10 Red flags before meeting Ukrainian women

These are some essential things and as for me they are obvious. However, every they I encounter men who don’t see anything wrong in usual scammer technologies and are trapped and scammed.

The things below don’t mean that the woman you are corresponding with is a 100 per cent scammer. They mean that such a woman is definitely worth checking.

  1. You received a letter first from a hot chick where she wants to get to know you better. It happens when you are registered on a dating site and your email can be given to individual girls who will start the hunt. The content of such letters is usually very similar to each other. Our experts most of the times can easily discover scam from the very first letter.
  2. She is young (up to 25), beautiful and intelligent and she claims that all the men in Ukraine are useless freaks and alcoholics. And she can’t find the normal one in Ukraine.
  3. She doesn’t want to share her skype, telephone number or email address (if you are on the agency site).
  4. She says she doesn’t have a proper Internet access (while communicating with you online), she says she can communicate only from the agency, friends’, internet clubs, she doesn’t have a computer and so on.
  5. She says she doesn’t speak English and offers an interpreting bureau to translate the letters. Usually the company she offers charges 3-5 times more for translations than for example our bureau can offer. It means she gets the half of the money.
  6. She insists to meet her only with her interpreter. It means she gets her interest from the interpreter.
  7. She wants to study English and says there is a very good teacher. Check the price (we can help you to check). Usually they give you 3-5 times more expensive prices.
  8. They don’t want to meet in the city they are from. It means they don’t want you to know where they actually live.
  9. They don’t give you links to their profiles on social network or they say they don’t have any.
  10. They write that they have fallen in love with you and they want to have sex with you after only a few letters between you.

So guys, as soon as you see any of these flags, just stop, think a bit and order a check. That will really save your time, money and nerves.

PA2

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A dating investigation from The Guardian

The men who go to Ukraine looking for a wife then fly home alone and broke

Ukraine’s internet romance industry is booming – despite the unrest. But after chatting online, travelling to Odessa and wooing women on flashy dates, most men fly home alone and far poorer. Are they unlucky in love, or have they been scammed?

These are trying times for Odessa. After the annexation of Crimea, pro-Russian forces are stirring tension in this Black Sea port, and there are weekly standoffs between demonstrators who want to be part of Ukraine and those who want closer ties to Russia. But for all the political and economic chaos that has engulfed Ukraine in the past three months, one industry is still thriving: the internet romance trade.

The economies of several Ukrainian cities are boosted by the surreal and disingenuous online bride business, and Odessa is the biggest hub. It does not take long for a visitor to the city to stumble upon an “international date” – there are legions of western men in town meeting with young women they have met online, usually with the conversation facilitated by a translator. At internet cafes and homes across the city, thousands of women spend hours each day chatting to prospective suitors online.

There is nothing like the prospect of economic hardship to facilitate intercontinental liaisons, and so, far from business drying up in recent months, the romance and “bride” trade is booming. If anything, there are now more western men planning trips to Odessa than there were last year, when I accompanied a “romance tour” to Ukraine for a magazine story. I spent a week in Odessa with 29 men, all of them hoping to find a wife during their trip. They were mainly Americans, but there were also Brits, an Italian and a Saudi on the tour.

I went with a company called Anastasia International, which is no grimy basement operation, but a huge company with a projected revenue last year of $140m (£84m). It has thousands of women in Ukraine and across the world on its books, available for chats and in-person meetings with lonely bachelors across the world looking for a wife.

As internet dating has gone mainstream over the past decade, Anastasia is attempting to rebrand what was once called the “mail-order bride” industry as something modern and progressive. This is no longer the preserve of seedy and exploitative men seeking vulnerable women from impoverished backgrounds to work as a longterm sex slave, the marketing suggests. This is “international dating”, a civilised way to find romance without borders.

Except that the branding is still somewhat disturbing. The men pay for every minute they chat online to a woman, something that it becomes clear is a dangerous part of the business model. The company claims on its website that finding a woman in Ukraine is like “dating a model, but with the values of your grandmother”. The men featured in testimonials are sick of western women, whom they insist have forgotten “family values”.

‘This is game time’
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Armed with this information, I was fully expecting to spend a week being nauseated by odious men preying on vulnerable women, and there were certainly a few on the trip whose misogyny reached prize-winning levels. But the overall story was far more complex.

“This is game time and they’re blowing me off,” Todd told me, mystified, one day over breakfast. It took the 43-year-old bread-delivery man from Delaware several months of working overtime to be able to afford the tour to Ukraine; he often clocked seven night shifts a week in order to save the roughly $5,000 (£3,000) he paid to spend a week in Odessa, and hopefully find a wife.

Todd, who had not succeeded in finding his other half at home, had something of a compulsive side to his personality. He spent months methodically whittling down 1,500 possible brides on Anastasia’s site to two top candidates. He then spent thousands of hours and thousands of dollars chatting with them online. Things were going swimmingly with both women. He assumed that his trip to Odessa would involve picking the one he liked most and taking her back with him. But when he arrived, neither of them answered his calls.

While Todd’s expectations for what a Ukrainian bride might offer were patently unrealistic, it was troubling to watch him venture ever further down the path of disappointment. Many of the men on the tour were less sympathetic characters than Todd, but all of them were lonely. Some of them were disillusioned with dating scenes in the west, where women did not give them a look; others recovering from a divorce or the death of a spouse.

Another man I spent a lot of time with was Stephen, a 62-year-old from Texas, long-divorced, who was on his 11th trip to Ukraine with the desperate hope of finding a wife.

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“I want a companion, because there are things I would like to do back home, but I don’t want to do them alone,” he told me. “I want to see the Grand Canyon, but I don’t want to see it on my own. I’m tired of having nobody to share my life with.”

Stephen ended up meeting a pianist named Elena on the tour. On date two she told him she thought he could be her soulmate. By the end of the week he was sure he had found his future life partner. It was an expensive week, with the dinners, taxis, and payment for a translator all adding up, but Stephen was delighted that he had found love.

But love in Odessa is not all it seems. Perhaps 10 years ago, the scenario had been what I imagined, with men swooping in, and women keen to swap the hard grind of poverty-stricken Ukraine for a new life in the US, even if it was a ramshackle house in a North Dakotan town or a sleepy midwestern farm, rather than a Manhattan penthouse or LA beachfront home.

Now, it seems, things are different. None of the men I became close to on my tour ended up in lasting relationships, and the majority appeared to fall victim to a number of sophisticated scams.

I left Stephen ready to propose, but two months later he told me by email that it had all unravelled. The woman let him know she needed more time before making a commitment, but suggested that he return to Odessa and continue their expensive platonic dates.

Todd did not even get to the date stage; in retrospect, perhaps a lucky escape. The women took their cut of cash for chatting with him, but did not answer his calls when he arrived. He later wrote to me: “It took me about a month to process what happened and get over it. I’ve decided to close that chapter in my life and move on. I am now concentrating on me and my life and to do things that make me a better person. And to pursue the other hopes and dreams that I have. Will I ever find my other half? One can only wonder. At least I can say I tried. If I die a bachelor, so be it.”

‘Emotional prostitution’
I was able to uncover exactly how the scams work due to a chance encounter with Alina, one of the women involved, who felt weighed down by her collusion in what she called “emotional prostitution”. She explained the whole sordid array of techniques, from a light impersonalised online-chatting version to a full-service chauffeur-driven platinum fraud, where men are rinsed of cash for a full week in Odessa, thinking they are cementing a lifelong relationship while actually they are being strung along on platonic dates that end with them dispatched to the airport with heavy hearts and empty wallets. Many of them come with ridiculous expectations, of course, but I am not sure that anyone deserves this treatment.

For the women as well, although hundreds of them make a living from the scams, it is not an easy psychological burden to bear. Alina was evidence of that, and 29-year-old Chris, the tour’s youngest member, found that when he confronted his date with accusations about the nature of the business, she burst into tears and said she felt awful, but needed the money to support her mother after her father had died. Other women were genuinely looking for a young and interesting partner and wanted to leave Ukraine, but spent hours chatting with elderly men in order to make money.

Anastasia International, while not directly colluding in the scams, runs a highly profitable business model that allows them to flourish. While real and lasting liaisons do occasionally form through the site, more often it only serves to increase the concentric circles of mistrust, disappointment and heartbreak for all involved. Anastasia insists that it weeds out scams whenever it finds them, and has banned some women from the site. It also says it will reimburse clients who fall victims to scams, and provides advice on how to avoid them.

Larry Cervantes, the company spokesman, wrote to me after the tour: “It’s true that some of these guys are spending money they don’t have. But guys go broke in the US chasing American women, as do Brits chasing Brits. So what’s the difference? Throughout history men have pursued the unattainable, and throughout history they’ve made fools of themselves. How is this any different?”

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But the difference, of course, is that the company is making a huge profit from the men making fools of themselves, and while many women are making money out of the schemes too, it is not clear that it is beneficial to them in the longer term.

Far from ending the practice, the recent unrest in Ukraine has only enhanced it. Alina told me that her friends working in the business are expecting several American men to arrive in the coming days, while the less discreetly named sugardaddyforme.com says it has seen record numbers of Ukrainian women sign up in recent months. The new Ukrainian government has rather a lot on its plate, but ending the trade in emotional exploitation is something they should tackle sooner rather than later.

Taken from The Guardian

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Chances to punish a scammer legally

This is an experience which occurs for the first time in my practice of working with foreigners in Ukraine. I am sure all of us know stories of incredible deceptions. Many of you have met scammers whose aim was your money, not you. And you spent money on them. You sent them certain amounts, paid their expenses, bought expensive gifts. The result is always the same. You realize that they have scammed you. How much money do you need to waste to understand the girl is a scam? 2k, 5k, 10k?

My new friend, a citizen of the UK, has given to a girl $25k in cash. Not to mention all other expenses and gifts. And I know he worked hard to earn it. They were engaged and the girl even visited his parents in India and was given all the honors a future wife can be given in a noble Indian family.

The story is a long one so I will make it short. The girl asked for money from the guy’s parents promising to give it back soon. They gave her $12k from their retirement money. But the girl never gave it back. Soon she stopped communicating with her fiancé. The man started an investigation and found out that his fiancée while being engaged with him was going out with 4 more other foreigners (when her man was in the UK) and they were giving her money too. So she ended up a very prominent scammer and a real whore as she had sex with all those men to get their money.

She refused to give back anything, neither the money the man and his family had given her, nor all the expensive presents and the engagement ring. The man was visiting Ukraine once a month. He found out all the information about her, her foreign lovers and her local boyfriends she was living with. He got information from her vk account and even information from her bank account. He met her parents and friends. What he wanted was to make her give the engagement ring back and the money she’d taken from his parent. No use.

When he met me and told the story I was quite sure he could do nothing with it, I told him just to forget about this nightmare. Otherwise he would waste more time and money with no result. But he was very persistent. So we found a good lawyer. The lawyer told him that his chances to win the process were miserable. All the money was given voluntarily and according to the civil and criminal code of Ukraine she had committed no crime.

The only chance was that she didn’t know about the possible legal consequences of such a lawsuit and would agree to cooperate on the stage of police activities connected with the procedure of the legal statement. So they drew up the statement and the lawyer took it to the police. First the police refused to accept it at all. But at last they agreed at least to bother the girl with questioning her. All the hope was that she would be afraid and would compensate at least something.

But she turned out to be a tough cookie. She just told the police to f@ck off and not to bother her with nonsense cases anymore.

The scammed man didn’t give up though. Now we are working with a lawyer specializing in civil cases. We want to get this case directly to the court. And the lawyer says the chances for success are 1 to 99 and even the chance that the court won’t refuse to listen to it is tiny.

To be updated..PA2.

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Updated Services and Prices

* First consulting – free

* Legal advice – $ 50 p/h

* Guide & Interpreter – $15-20 p/h (depends on occasion) ($100 per day)

* Hidden interpreter service 20 p/h

* Written translation – $5-10 per letter (depends on content)

* Translation of letters – $100 per month for 2 persons

* Phone translation – $5 per phone call

* Trip planning – $100

* Airport “Borisipol” pick up – $40 (taxi + interpreter)

* Accommodation booking – $20 per booking

* Mobile phone + sim rent – $15 per week

* Flowers & Gifts delivery – $20 for delivery + flowers’ price

* Transportation reservation – $10 for one reservation

* Russian classes – $15 per class

* Women check – $50-500

* Woman search (matchmaking) – $500 – 1000 to start full range of search and $1000-2000 finders fee after the successful result (depends on the search time and conditions)

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Your personal interpreter in Ukraine

Every time you are in Ukraine and need an interpreter, hire them yourself.

When you go for a date with a girl from the agency she will insist to have her own interpreter. You know what it means? She makes money on you.

Here is the scheme from the agencies: you pay, let’s say” $20 per hour. $5 goes to the agency, $10 to the interpreter and $5 to the girl you are meeting with. And the girl you are meeting with might be able to speak English by herself.

Tell her that you have your own interpreter. If she gets sad about it she is in the scam scheme. If she insists to have her own interpreter, she is probably needs only money from you.

Of course there is a little possibility that she is just to shy and she needs her person to feel more comfortable. But this is the main reason scammers use to make you pay them. You see, your own interpreter will act on your behalf and they can identify a scammer right there just watching her and speaking to her. This is what scammers are afraid of.

If your Lady still insists to have her own interpreter giving a hell of different reasons (shyness, fear of a stranger, agency’s demand, etc.) offer her to have 2 interpreters – yours and hers.

If she rejects this too (in case you still want to meet her) hire a hidden interpreter. It means your interpreter will seat next table listening to all your chats. It is the best way to identify a scammer. They think you don’t speak Russian so they will communicate with each other and reveal a lot of information in Russian. You can leave them several times for different reasons for a couple of minutes. And during this time they will definitely share their emotions and impressions about you. Which will tell you about the girl’s real intentions.

Within an hour you will know everything you need about the girl. So you will safe your time and money.

Feel free to ask us about these services in any city of Ukraine.

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Looking for a native speaker English teacher for Nikolaev and/or a business partner

Hello guys,

Our English school in Nikolaev English Masters is looking for a native English teacher. You don’t need to be a professional teacher. A candidate needs to be active, creative, talkative, good fun, with good and correct speech and pronunciation. We will study him the rest.

We will engage you in our teaching process with adult and young students. This is a great chance to penetrate into Ukrainian culture, to understand our people, find new friends and even a sole mate. A lot of women teach English to find someone from abroad and get married to him.

You will also have our friendship and full support. We will be your guides and coaches. Our team will help you with any issue you can have in Nikolaev. You will be safe and supported.

We will probably not be able to offer a salary which will cover all your expenses for life in Ukraine. But if you are going to spend some time in Ukraine or expat and retire here that will be an addition to your incomes.

We are thinking of expanding our business to open new branches of our school. So if a man wants to invest any money into small businesses like English schools we will be glad to find not only a teacher but also a business partner. And here your stay in Ukraine will be profitable.

We also have some other business projects to start with small investments. If you want to come and stay in Ukraine and find good and supportive friends here along with your own business, you are welcome.

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A story from Andy

I am going to take my time and say some things on here. First i am from the USA, i have been married to a Ukrainian woman for the last 25 years, before we got married we dated for over 3 years. We have two grown boys 24, 22 out of college and own their own, and a 14 year old girl still at home. We did not meet in any dating or marriage agency as i do not think such a thing existed at all in 1988. We meet in a airport in Berlin in 1988. My flight was delayed due to weather over the UK, her flight was delayed due to a suspicious package. Yes i know, the chances for a Ukrainian woman and a man from the USA to meet in an airport in Berlin, Germany was very much luck, or fate, or none of those. After an hour or so of casual conversation and my attempts to put a country with her accent, as her English was really good. She told me she was from Sumy, Ukraine. That made me flinch. Yes it did. Because i knew exactly where Ukraine was and it was very much apart of the Soviet Union. Maybe i had watched too many James Bond films, or read too many Tom Clancy novels. So based on my very limited experience with someone from Russia, i asked if her name was Olga. Yes it was a joke to me, and i considered it an ice breaker for me, since i was looking for men wearing black suits watching me. And yes, that is like going to Utah and asking a woman there if her name is Ann. I could tell by her stare and the ever slight frown that she was not overly amused with my choice of giving her a name. A few awkward moments of silence went by and she told me her name was Valeria. Not what i was expecting to hear, and quite frankly one of the best sounding female names there is in any language. She then went on to tell me her friends and family call her Lera and asked if i wanted to be her friend. So here was this incredibly beautiful, to me, 5 foot 10 inch tall, blonde hair, blue eyed young woman, i am one month older than her, asking me if i wanted to be friends. Humm, it was game over for me right then and there in my search for a woman, that frankly hadn’t really begun yet, and something i did not plan to do until i was old, like 22.

The early years for us was not easy in any language. We had stiff resistance from our parents, and as well from our different governments. And i was in more than one fight over being called the guy with a “ruskie” girlfriend. The one thing we did have going for us, we were both 18 and declared adults by both our countries so, that was about all. Our parents though it was a “phase” we would grow out of. My father in law never called me by my name, even on his death bed in 2011, i was simply “the American” ,as he had always called me. Like wise, my mother in law supported her daughter’s decision, and that was that. Our kids? No, they never knew any of this and were family, despite who mom and dad were. Our parents always had time for the kids, even if they did not have time for us. The kids spent as much time as possible in Ukraine while growing up. The boys always make time to go to Ukraine to see family and friends there, they are also correcting the vast majority of Americans who could not find Ukraine on a globe, with what is happening there with Russia. My youngest and only daughter, has no love for Ukraine. I can get her to go to the dentist easier than i can get her on a plane to Ukraine. Why? Who knows. Well enough about me.

Some of the comments i have read on here and similar sites from my fellow American man, and other western man, i can only tell you this. Stay home and find a whore, it is cheaper and faster. As that is what i get you are looking for in a wife, just from your own comments. You are trying to take a woman out of her country, from everyone and everything she knows, move her halfway around the world up or down, from her family, friends, literally everything she knows. And yet you make comments about “oh the cost” and everything related to her is “money”. Since she will be depending on you 100 percent for everything, that is not cheap, and since that is a problem you should find a local woman and be happy with her. Frankly, since you put a “dollar” amount on your woman i still suggest you keep a whore on call, as you are guaranteed to get something for your money that you are worried about.

Thanks to some, but not all, Slavic males, you will have to work a lot harder finding a Slavic woman than you would finding a woman in your own country. Get adjusted to that right now. As the author of this thread plainly stated and i second, the main competition between women there is other women, and if they catch a man’s eye, oh well. There is plenty of Russian and Ukrainian male sayings about this, and none of them are polite, “My wife dresses up for her friends” comes to mind here, i’m sure others will post more about that.

Now for you American guys, she will and i mean she will become Americanized very, very, very fast. Forget all the BS you might have been sold by those overcharging dating marriage agency. For the first few months, maybe a year, she will act as when you first meet her in her country. How will you know? When she goes out in flip flops, t-shirt, shorts, hair in a ponytail and no make-up. And she will, trust me. No, she will not go out to dinner, special event or “women’s” shopping looking like that, she will venture up to the grocery store and local areas, to fit in with the other women, who do the same. She will also figure out very fast that the laws in North America are more enforced than where she is from. So don’t be surprised in the first few months if she is charged with bribery trying to bribe a cop out of a speeding ticket. Something similar will probably happen. It takes years, not months to adjust to a new place.

For the rest of your marriage and active life, expect to make at least one trip a year back to her country, more than that if a family illness or wedding happens. So don’t be leaving Ukraine,Russia or other former Soviet bloc and thinking you will never be back. Another thing, never, ever get caught alone in a room with any of her female friends, even if you are just talking. By that i mean, do not have a friend of hers at your apartment while you are waiting for her to show up, big no-no, even if you have to tell her friend to wait outside for her. Matter of fact, if you have a female translator i would ask her to wait outside until she showed up, most good translators will know this already. Yes, her friends will try to play similar games. They will flirt, call, text, email, you name it. This does not stop once you have said “I do”. If she tells you to spend time with her female friend(s), or says she does not care, she is playing you. The majority of affairs over there happen with “friends” not strangers or friends of friends. Write that down.

The fun really begins when you have the wedding, i would suggest doing that over there, and a formal ceremony back in America, as American weddings are boring compared to weddings in Slavic countries. Paying the ransom for my bride, was probably one of the most funniest, memorial days of my whole life, three different amounts, three pumpkins, a whole 30 story apartment building keeping me from my bride on the top floor. American ingenuity doesn’t cover what i did to reach that top floor with all the elevators mysteriously not working! If the woman you want to meet is from a rural area, or what they call a village, it will be more traditional and outside.

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